Topic: New Scam - Beware of it

[Flyingifr]

A new scam is coming to us from India - it seems the scammers got their hands on the computer files of some on line Payday Loan company sites. The biggest source of their victims seems to be Lowlender.com ( http://www.lowlender.com/ ) since a lot of the names these scammers use as company names google search to this site. Among the names used are:

US National Bank as the payday Loan lender (There is no such bank in the US)
US Bureau of Investigation
United Legal Investigation
US Legal Investigation
United States Legal Investigation
United States Investigation

(note, there may be others as the scammers seem to make up names that are designed to sound like Governmental agencies at will) These names are only the ones that I have found so far, and they all follow the same tactic. While I usually take what I see on Ripoff Reports with a grain of salt, the reports there on this outfit are simply too consistent with each other and too consistent with what was found on other sites to be coincidence. Here is a sample ROR report:

I received a phone call on my cell phone from this guy with an indian accent claiming to work for the United Legal Investigation Company. He asked me my name and tried to verify my SS#. He advised me that I was going to be arrested in 1 hour and that I need to cooperate and that the phone lines are recorded directly to the courts (Which right away I knew was ). I advised him that he had the wrong SS# Which he did actually have the correct #. He then advised that I was committing fraud by lying to him. he stated I would be fired by my job (Which I am self employed) and advised that the authorities are on their way now and that he represented a company called CASHNET COMPANY.com ( I have never heard of it) and that they are filing a serious lawsuit against me. As he was talking I was looking up his phone # of 213-226-6944 which is registered to a company in Los Angeles CA called SAVEMYLOAN.com. I tried to access the page online but it does not exist. I told him I had enough and that he better no call again. That is when he rattled off my home address and said in 1 hour there will be officers at my door to arrest me. I said I will wait for them and to send them right away. HE said They will be there in one hours time!. I then called our local police department to file a report of harassment and attempt to commit fraud. They documented the incident and advised that if he does call back that they will begin an investigation. DO NOT FALL FOR THIS> OTHERS ON THIS SITE HAVE BEEN VICTIMIZED BY GIVING THEIR BANK INFORMATION TO HIM> Someone in LOS ANGELES NEEDS TO GET THESE SCAMMERS ARRESTED RIGHT AWAY BEFORE OTHER PEOPLE ARE CONNED>

Source: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/365/RipOff0365955.htm

Another similar report from a different site:

Wow I can't believe that there are sooo many people out there that have received this call also.. They(Jack Austin) first started calling me at work and on my cell phone.. I too was told that I had to send them money in regards to some outstanding bills that I had.. I was sooo worried because the bills were ACTUALLY legit, but I just didnt feel comfortable sending them money..  He would not send me anything in the mail, wanted to do everything via fax machine and the money sent Western Union..  Once he realized that I was catching on to him, he told me I was going to get arrested at 4pm at my place of employment, and hung up on me, he told me that there was NOTHING else that I could do to resolve this matter.  I was scared, very much so.. They wanted me to agree on paying 1200.00 via Western Union when my 2 bills didnt even total 700.00.. It is CRAZY!!!!  Please if ANYONE receives any calls from these guys, DO NOT GIVE THEM ANY INFORMATION ON YOU.. IT MAY SEEM SOOOO REAL, BUT IF YOU CANT PAY THEM WITH A CREDIT CARD, OR CHECKING ACCOUNT THEN THEY USUALLY ARENT REAL... I mean comeon now, you can pay the GOVERNMENT when you owe taxes with a credit card.. Its a shame that there are people out there that live on other peoples hard earned money..
Caller ID: 216-920-0510
Caller: United States Legal Investigation Bureau

Source: http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-216-920-0510

And still another:

24 June 2008 818-688-7215

Starting today at 0715, a man with a thick Indian accent, identifying himself as Erick Scott, a United Processing Legal technician with the US Investigation Bureau, started calling my workplace, telling me that I was under investigation for check fraud -- charges filed against my SSN -- which he downloaded. He told me in order to stop the investigation, I would need to send $1100 via MoneyGram. I told him that I have received other phone calls from his department, and that I had reported them to the FDCP, the FBI, the Secret Service, and the State attorney, and that HE was under investigation, and told him not to call again. He did, telling me, "You better listen to me, you stupid b*****." I hung up. He called several more times, and even had the nerve to ask for my manager's name, and when they would be in. He called her, and told her that she better make me listen, or he would have the cops come and put me in handcuffs and take me to jail. She told him that he should do what he needed to do as far as having me arrested, and that he needed to call me at home, that it was illegal for him to call my work, and that further calls from this company would be terminated immediately.

Source: http://praisechapel.ning.com/profiles/blog/show?id=2137263%3ABlogPost%3A20230

There are hundreds of similar reports on the web, but the common traits are these:

1: The caller will be from India
2. The caller will threaten immediate arrest if not paid by Western Union
3. The caller will make it sound like then police are already on tehir way
4. The caller will make failing to pay a debt sound like criminal fraud
5. The caller will NEGOTIATE with you if you plead you cannot make the payment demanded immediately but can make a smaller payment
6. The caller will not provide anything in writing
7. The caller is using a pretexed phone number.
8. The caller caller will hang up on you the second you show any knowledge of your rights under law or challenge their assertions that you have committed a crime.
9. The phone number they give you is a spoof - it is either perpetually busy, never answered or not in service. I have already checked up on at least a dozen different numbers they give out, and this was the case for all of them.

I cannot stress this too much - DO NOT FALL FOR THIS!!!!!

Here is a post I made on his topic on another Board:

These guys thought out this scam very well, making up bogus companies that supposedly were borrowed from (notably one "US National Bank" which does not exist anywhere in the US) and using names for their "company" that sound like law enforcement (like "US Bureau of Investigation" among others). The West Virginia Attorney General is actively looking for these thieves but I suspect will be unsuccessful. The only way to actually find them would be for them to contact someone in Law Enforcement who is knowledgeable about the existence of this scam who actually allows a payment to be made and then follow the money - but I suspect even then the trail will be left cold as the money flows through several foreign countries with strict bank secrecy laws and few extradition agreements with the US. I have been actively looking for more info on these thieves for a while now without success. The US phone numbers they give out simply are either always busy or never answered. Ostensibly these people got their leads from an on line Payday Loan site. I took out a Payday Loan once from a local company here in Tucson several yars ago, paid it back and that was that. I have not yet been contacted by these scammers.

I have been contacted on several occasions with a similar scam - offering to lower my credit card interest rates, but the people who speak to me will never give me any meaningful information about their identity or their company and insist on getting my credit card information immediately "so we can start helping" (ostensibly helping themselves to my considerable credit lines). When I start asking too many questions or simply balk at providing the information they want, they hang up. The caller ID prone number is from the Dominican Republic, but the people speak perfect American English. I suspect the Caller ID number is as phony as they are.

This propensity to quickly disconnect the call when faced with any skepticism is what has so far kept them out of jail because they only steal from the gullible, not people who are knowledgeable enough to lay down a paper trail.

There are plenty of people out there who are trying to scam you out of your money. There is no substitute for skepticism and vigilance.

Source: http://www.debt-consolidation-credit-repair-service.com/forums/showthread.php?t=289041

[Rottweiler]

This is what I got when I searched at "Debt Consolidation Care"  for only one of those fake entities ("U.S. National Bank"):

http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/resources/search-result.php?cx=002940997111014779860%3Ae4jfo9dtire&q=US+National+Bank&cof=FORID%3A11#965

At least a dozen pages of search results that tied to just this ONE "alias"!  The common theme there is the same as everywhere else...fraud...and the collector's M.O. is the same .  Like here, in a guest posting from the site of August 12, 2008:

http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/collection-agencies/us-national-bank-fraud.html

Posted: Tue Aug 12, 2008 8:29 pm Subject: U.S. National Bank Fraud     
received a phone call today 8/12/08 from this number(818) 530-1886. I spoke with gentlemen named Matthew who he was calling on behalf of U.S. National bank started reading over the phone a legal affidavit against me and said that on Wednesday 8/13/08 there will be a judgement against me for not paying back a payday loan. He had all my information address, last four of my SSN#. He said that the sheriff would be picking me up from work and taking me to the courthouse on Wednesday 8/12/08. I did contact Lancaster Texas Police Department and filed a report and was advised that if they come to my resident or job contact them or near police department and don't go with them.

I have never received any certified mail in regards to this. The guy on the phone said that legal affidavit stated fraud and something else. I asked him to email me what he was looking at and he said he couldn't. He told me that the payday loan was for $300 and now I would end up owing over $5000 which includes fees, interest and attorney fees. I told him I don't have an attorney.

Nice...   Threats they cannot take...and refusal to verify debt.

And it involves more than "Lowlender.com" files; "Cashnet"--a fraudulent operation itself--is another (a.k.a:  Cashnet500, Global Payday, Global Pay Day Loan LLC, Cash Net ). 

http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/collection-agencies/usnationalbank-affidavit.html

This thread reports almost the exact same lies as in the quote above...and the same exact monetary demand.  Users at that site have also experienced calls from numbers which trace to anywhere BUT India:  Calls have been reported as showing 805 area code in California;TN,MI,NC,NY,FL, and other places, not just the Caribbean.

[Flyingifr]

I spent almost an hour on the phone today with these people and was given lie after lie after lie - to the point where they couldn't even keep them straight.

Simple question - "What is the name of your Company?"

Answers given:
National Processing Division
Sonic Cash Net

Simple question: "What is your name?"
Answers given (all by the same person):
Justin Smith
Justin B Smith
Mark Redd
XXXXXXX (it was MY NAME!!!!)

Simple Question: "What is your email address?"
Answer Given:
XXXXXXX.XXXXX@gmail.com (the XXXX was MY NAME!!!)

Simple Question: "What is your Street Address?"
Answers given:
We don't have one - followed by the question "then where do you go to get to work?"
9 Fordham Drive Plainview NY (a private house)
Somewhere in Irvine CA (Justin didn't know where in Irvine he was)
AHS423 Suite 000 Irvine CA
c/o Atlantic Media Washington DC (once again Justin didn't know where in DC he was)

It got to the point that Justin couldn't keep his lies straight and couldn't stay on one side of the country. He spoke with a Caribbean or African accent, as did everyone I heard in the background, so I suspect the have a boiler room in either the Caribbean or in Africa,

At first they couldn't find my "file" but after I pursued it they said that my file had already been "downloaded" but they wouldn't say to whom or where.

My advice stands - if you get this type of call, don't even be civil, Curse at them like a drunken sailor with an STD. If they threaten you will arrest, stand up to them and threaten them again. At one point in the call I thanked Justin for staying on the line so long because it gave the FBI time to trace the call. He somehow got me mixed up with a lawyer in NJ and I let him believe that's what I am.

[Kitten]

At one point in the call I thanked Justin for staying on the line so long because it gave the FBI time to trace the call.

That might be the way to go. If I could somehow call the Fibbers on another line, and get them to initiate the trace without losing the scammer while I talk to the Feds, I bet they could find him in an hour's time. The problem is getting the trace initiated without arguing with the Federal fools for an hour.

[Pablo]

I just noticed recently that the BBB and 800notes have been making warnings about this.  They are obviously phonies because they don't do what even a real collection does (such as no mini-miranda statement, they cannot answer simple questions such as their name, their address, their phone number, they refuse any dispute, they threaten (and curse) with illegal actions such as coming to get you or arrest.  They refuse to send any collection notice let alone the VOD.  They want payment immediately via check/credit card/money gram/western union.  They refuse mailed payments.  One poster told them to talk to his attorney and each time the "collector" hung up on the attorney. I was horrified about all the people (sad!) that had posted. (more information below):

http://800notes.com/articles/News.aspx/UmghNAGYQwANpAjL5OOhYA

and

http://www.bbb.org/us/article/widespread-harassment-from-phony-debt-collectors-raises-concerns-of-mass-data-breach-11792

[Rottweiler]

Thanks for the BBB link, Pablo. 

I went to the site, and got an eyeful:

Claiming to be lawyers, the scammers say they are with the “Financial Accountability Association” or the “Federal Legislation of Unsecured Loans”...

Not only do we have scammers who are engaging in UPL, but anyone with a half a brain would think "What kind of attorneys don't know squat about law?"  (I know what we think about some attorneys, but even they have to have enough knowledge of the law to pass the Bar Exam.)

More proof they know squat about law:

[T]he scammers accuse the victim of defaulting on a payday loan and claim they are being sued. The phony debt collector threatens that, if the victim doesn’t pay ...immediately via wire or by providing bank account or credit card numbers, he or she will be arrested and extradited to California within the hour to stand trial

Uh, since they have no idea of the difference in procedure between civil and criminal law...
 

How did they get the information?  Easy:  Someone purloined...or SOLD them...old data files from scummy payday lenders!  Note the information the scammers are reputed to have:

Social Security, old bank account numbers or driver’s license numbers...home addresses, employer information...the names of personal friends and professional references. 

Look at any payday lender application and one would see that the information required is the same.  The likelihood is these scammers bought the legally uncollectible alleged debts from illegal payday loan shops and/or are directly owned and/or affiliated with one or more of them.

[breeolson143]

I too have fallen prey to these calls, still happening in 2010. I was smart enough to NOT give them any info, and was advised by my local credit Counselor to NOT give thenm the time of day, don't v all them back and if you do get them on the phone, threaten to report them to Homeland Security.
The problem I now have is them calling at work constantly. Our receptionist understands these calls are phony but often if she is not there, the fill in will patch them through. How do you recommend getting these creeps to stop calling work?

[Dollar short]

Pablo, one of the people gave some good advice on that Website. He said " NEVER speak to ANY Debt Collector on the phone. Demand that everything be in writing, and you only use certified mail, return reciept requested. Be sure to put the certified# on the letter itself and keep a copy for your records."
I personally had not thought about putting the certified number on the actual letter.

[transborder]

I always put the certified letter # on any letters I send out.

[kj2010]

Hi! I'm new here. Just to add to the list I received a phone call on 1/6/11 from "Criminal Investigation Department". The number was a New York area code. "Officer Jack Wilson" with the Asian/Arabic accent . I asked for his badge ID number. Of course he hesitated then spouted off some numbers. He stated that I had 5 felony charges on my SSN. Hmm....I asked what those charges were. He said that they were for check fraud, internet fraud, etc etc. He then stated I had taken out an internet payday loan from US Cash Advance or some other for $200.00. I asked to to verify this and of course he couldn't. But he did have my SSN, Bank name routing and account numbers, birthday, etc.
 I also upset him by repeating back everything he said. (I am trying not to laugh) He then told me I must wire him $5000.00 immediately or I would be arrested. I  laughed out loud after hearing this. He seemed to be upset at me laughing. I asked him if he was sending an officer know to arrest me. He said Yes. I said make sure they are the good looking ones.
I hung up then called back and someone named Nancy with the same accent answered "Criminal Investigation Department"
I did call the FTC and file a complaint. FTC has heard this scenario many times. The lady there said most likely the phone calls originate from India.
Oh the number on my caller ID from this so called department is 347-416-5124 . I reversed numbered and it seemed to be some kind of cell phone.

[BJ_Lurker]

The fake payday loan collectors remain quite active, maybe moreso than ever. Those of us with experience fielding more legitimate (even if marginally) collection calls see through their outrageous tactics, but I believe we are the minority. Hardly a day passes that I don't see a few new complaints on the unknown caller forums. The stories share a running theme of foul-mouthed reps with thick foreign accents and their extreme threats of legal and police action. Reactions range from suspicion to bewilderment. Almost no one reporting realizes we have Fair Debt laws which make the typical caller conduct so obviously criminal, however difficult to prosecute.

Faux Names

The outsourced criminals like to use scary, legal-sounding business names. A few are borrowed from real entities, most are fabricated, seemingly by picking random legal-ish words from a hat. These three are lately reported most often:

Affidavit Consolidation Services
Central Investigation & Litigation
National Affidavit Processing Services (or "Center" or "Department")


The following faux names were compiled from various mystery call forums and news reports. This I'm sure is not a complete list:

American Law Division
American Legal Processing Division
American Legal Services
Attorney General's Office (insert state here)
Bureau of Crime Identification
Bureau of Criminal Investigation (or "BCI")
Bureau Department of Criminal Investigations
Crime Monitoring Services
Crime Protection & Investigation
Criminal Bureau of Identity
Criminal Investigation Bureau (or "Department")
Cyber Crime Division
Department of Criminal Investigations
Department of Financial Crime
Department of Law & Investigation(s)
Federal Crime Investigations
Federal Fraud Investigations
Federal Investigation Bureau
Federal Investigations Company
Federal Legislation of Unsecured Loans
Financial Accountability Association
Financial Crime Division (or "Department")
Financial Crimes Enforcement Network
Financial Crimes Unit
First State Attorney
Investigation Services
Monetary Crime Division
National Bureau of Crime Investigations
National Check Restitution
National Criminal Center
United Client Suspect Department
United Financial Crime Department (or "Division")
United Legal Processing
United Nation Legal Department
U.S. Crime Suspect Department
U.S. Federal Bank
U.S. Investigation Bureau
U.S. Justice Department: Payday Loan Division
U.S. Legal Investigation Bureau
U.S. National Bank
White Collar Crime Unit


As of Autumn 2010 the new wrinkle was posing as employees of the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC), which uneducated debtors may not realize has zero ties to debt collection. Here are a few of the storefront and collector style names associated with this scam:

Cash Advance USA
CashNet
Christian Nicholas & Associates
Hopkins Law Office
Midline Marketing
Morgan Associates
Sonic Bank
National Processing
United Cash legal department
United Pay Services


The overseas reps frequently adopt vanilla American names and pose as law enforcement. Sometimes their aliases negate all credibility, such as these:

James Brown  (hardly carrying a brand new bag)
John Henry  (in retirement from laying rail tracks)
Steve Martin  (truly as "The Jerk")
John Smith  (What, no Jane Doe?)
Will Smith  (slumming from a faltering movie career)
Denzel Washington  (There could be two, right?)


Brutal Tactics

The flimsy business names and aliases are of course absurd, but they've fooled enough people each week to make this perhaps the fastest growing phone scam of 2010. The scam also frightens and upsets people, particularly those who have never experienced "real" debt collection calls from the tamer American agencies. These are the sorts of semantically ridiculous yet convincing claims heard fairly commonly:

- "We are downloading warrants against you."
- "We are filing an affidavit against you."
- "You will get your social security blocked."
- "You have complaints against your social security number."
- "You have committed fraud against the government."


This is on top of the more "normal" empty threats of arrest and imprisonment, borrowed from the worst U.S. agencies. Many reps toss a scripted rotten cherry on top as they end the calls, such as "Only God can help you now", or wishing the victim "good luck".

Here are abridged quotes from some consumer forums which reveal how ugly these threats become:

".... threatening that I would be arrested and jailed for 2 months ... If I ask any questions he becomes tempermental and starts telling me how I will be raped and beaten in jail. ... says he's downloading my file to the sheriff ..."

"After informing the indian gentleman on the phone that the person he is seeking cannot be reached at this number he asked if he could pay me for sex. When I asked for his name and supervisor he said f--k your mother. He has also stated that he wants to my lemons and that he is going to teach me a lesson."

"... said his name was officer John peterson.. told my work he was the sherriff looking for me .... called back not 2 hours later and told my work he was the emergency room .... I have a 22 month old it was all i could do not to break down before i called his nursery ...."


The kicker is that much of the time the callers already possess bank data, SSN, and other identifiers of their victims. Such data are used to 'convert' a victim into believing in a legitimate claim. The trafficking of such data among Indian and Pakistani call centers full of abusive thugs should alone cause alarm.


Nascent Investigation

Theories vary as to the food chain of this scam, but there is a strong suggestion the U.S. payday lenders sit at the start.

- They may have sold data from application forms for unprocessed loans, as a means of monetizing dud papers. This parallels the practice of fraudulent internet-based services, which sell off email addresses from abandoned accounts to the spam gangs, usually after the second or third year of account dormancy.

- American PDL firms may be quietly orchestrating the scam, feeding data from both dud and processed loans, some of the latter being already repaid by consumers. This would amount to a double dip or worse, while laundering the fraud through overseas call centers.

- One theory from Autumn 2010 holds that a disbarred Florida debt collector may have changed names and tactics to keep plying his trade. The story is expanded on mystery call site WhoCalledUs and others. There is at least one other kingpin story like this I've seen but cannot corroborate. Further reading: http://whocalled.us/lookup/5598235337


Having only theories and not confirmed business entities to prosecute on U.S. soil is frustrating. For the moment, consistent use of appropriate complaint channels is required. The FTC and attorneys general are always good venues, and I understand the FBI is keeping an ear to this issue as well. Given the international nature of this fraud traffic, it will take coordinated effort and a critical mass of complaints to wring some justice from this vile offshoot tendril of the debt industry.

[itsmeagain]

Thank you for the in-depth analysis of this rogue industry.  It should be required reading for anyone considering a payday loan.

[pinklady1275]

Regarding this new SCAM....  I do believe it is alive and well!!!  My story goes like this:  I never answer a phone call that is listed as "Unknown or Unlisted".  I let it go to voice mail.  When checking my messages I came across a message left on April 13, 2011 at 11:00am. The call was hard to figure out as there was a lot of static on the line.  The accent was kind of British but I have heard this accent before dealing with a different scam and coming from London.  The caller stated "This call is a Warning for pinklady 1275, my name is [b]David Jones [/b]with #$%&#$* Department of *%#$&^* Investigations and Charges are filed against you for Fraud. Call me as soon as you get this message.  My name is Jones,  David Jones"....through the static I could barely make out his asking someone in a whisper..."tell her what kind of charges?......Ok"....no sound of anyone responding. then he continued with...."My number is 397-1998.... that is 253-397-1998 and ask for David Jones", click the message ended.

The call was placed to me on my cell phone and using my AKA name, (this name I have not used for over 5 years and especially since becoming a member with Debtorboards).  I only use my name as it appears on my Social Security Card, my drivers license  and the name that I have worked very hard to correct on all 3 Credit Reporting Agencies.  So already I know there is something not right with this call and  thousands of red flags are going up all over the place.  I immediately do a reverse call look up.  The number is listed as a private line and is located in Auburn, WA.  I have no clue who this might be.  I do believe this is a scam and with as much static on the line and the British accent I believe the call is probably from out of the country.  I did try the number late at night and the response when the call was placed was, "The extension you have called is not monitored", click and they terminated the call.  Nothing about leave a message or anything else. 

I did use the services of CASH NET years ago and that account was resolved favorably.  It makes sense that this message left on my cell phone is concerning the same issue as you describe as a scam.  I'm glad I read this post as it answers many questions about this message left on my voice mail.  As for charges being brought against me for fraud.......  I have done nothing  to warrant such charges and  I have no outstanding  debt thanks to all the hard work and advise from Debtorsboards.    All I can say is let them bring it on!!  I'm ready for them!!!   

Beware the above listed name and phone number!!!   

[duh]

I have been wondering if mine was fake or real.

It goes like this.

They leave the following message, in a very thick Indian accent on my phone.

This is so and so calling for American Express. This call is for XXXX X XXXXXX.
Please return this call. This is not a consideration call. My hours of operation are from 8AM easterm to 12PM. Please return the call.

I tried to return the call after the 10tgh or 12 received from them and I was given a message that says.

If you are a cureenet or past cardholder with American Express push #1, if you never had a card with American Express push #2.
Well, I pushed #2 and was told to leave my name and phone and was told they would verify this and if correct would delete my name.

I called back and was told to leave my name and phone number and they would
return my call.

So I tried to get them a couple more times.... same messages.

Finally, they called my mother's phone and I just happened to answer. The man asked for me in that Indian accent and I toild him he had the wrong number.

They are calling my cell, but not leaving messages.

And I finally answered my own phone on one of their calls and when they asked for me I again said they had a wrong number.

That was about a week ago, and since then, they have not called back.

But.... I did get a letter from a CA regarding what I surmise is this specific
account.... The CA is in Calif. and I need to DV next week.

[lpgirl2324]

I have been called by a guy with an Indian accent named Norman. I didn't answer so he left me a voicemail stating I need to call them or my attorney in refrence to a fraud charge against me. The number he called from was 646-328-2045. Icalled and they said I had money that was deposited into my account from a payday loan from Ace. I told them I never got money and they kept telling me I did. I asked when it was deposited or a copy of the paperwork and they said they don't know the exact day and ill get copies once I paid. He told me if I didn't pay That God help me. I don't know what to do can some one help me. I'm at witts end.